Full Lecture Transcript (Cleaned)
Nams, text, and scholarly paradigms — 0:00
in today's q a we have uh sister israel from australia emailing and saying that how do we understand the hadith regarding the prohibition of plucking of the eyebrows and the fact that allah's curse is on this and is there any exception for this ruler so this hadith or this question actually i'm actually going to spend a good amount of time discussing it not because of the issue itself but we're going to use this as a case study because it's very important that we understand some of the reasons why our scholars differ and uh so today i will actually be going into a lot of detail to demonstrate uh the fact that uh different scholars have different ways of approaching the tradition and inshallah ta'ala whichever position that you follow there should be an understanding and an acceptance and a respect and a tolerance for other opinions out there the hadith in question is a hadith that is mentioned or narrated by ibm and it is reported in bukhari and muslim and it is a much longer hadith but the key phrase in it is that even reported that the prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam said that he cursed rasulullah well that the prophet saw cursed the ladies that put on markings or tattoos and the ones that asked for these tattoos to be put on and the ones who anna misat and namisat we'll just translate it for now is the plucking of the eyebrows we're going to come back to this translation those ladies that ask for their eyebrows to be uh to be uh plucked uh those that change the creation of allah almighty changing the creation of allah and the the the or the curse has been mentioned in this case from the prophet and then it has also been narrated isla who allah himself has cursed so both of these narrations are found and it is an authentic hadith because it is mentioned in the sahih now as i said today i'm actually going to go into quite a lot of detail because i really want to use this as a case study so that we broaden our horizons and so that we understand why and how we uh our scholars have looked at these texts and why there is a spectrum of opinion in a nutshell what we see is that really and again i'm being a little bit simplistic for now in a nutshell we see that there's different ways or paradigms to look at these traditions and we can say for the purposes of our talk today that we can categorize the scholars who looked at this tradition into two categories the first category were those who took it at face value who took it at its literal value and they didn't really think about the causes or the concerns or the reasons behind this tradition and they simply took this and that's a valid paradigm and they applied it uh without any uh you know conditions without any circumstance it is applied unconditionally across the board and this is the position that is well known and you will find this very common on most q a websites that answer islam islamic questions and other you know uh you know scholars of that are you know well established on social media and well-known it's very common to hear this position that it is completely unconditional and there are no exceptions and at the same time you have another group of scholars um from the beginning of time who looked at these traditions and they tried to understand well what is the cause or what is the reason such that we will apply this hadith when that cause exists when the reason is the same we will apply that hadith but when the reason does not exist then maybe the hadith or the ruling narrated in this hadith is not going to apply and in fact you see this this uh this tension you see these two different paradigms you see it even from the beginning of time in fact you see it in the famous incident of the sahaba themselves when the prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam told the sahaba to pray salat al-assar in the place or the lands of the banu now this is a very interesting hadith that really demonstrates this i don't want to call it tension because the sahaba did not quite have attention amongst them but it is a tension of understanding there wasn't an actual tension between them there was a tension of understanding and it's a very very eye-opening episode in the lifetime of the prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam that demonstrates that texts can be understood differently and the question of how literal do you want to be or how much rationale do you want to be that this is actually it's a very natural tension there's nothing un-islamic there's nothing modernistic there's nothing that goes against our iman in allah and his messenger both of these camps equally believe in allah and his messenger and we find them amongst the sahaba now what is this story and it is a very important story the story is that or the the incident is that uh the day that uh allah the same day that allah miraculously uh caused the confederates to uh uh scatter helter skelter the army of the confederates the battle of the assab right as you know that sandstorm came and the morning that they woke up and they prayed salatin and lo and behold the entire camps have cleared 10 thousand have disappeared masha'allah because allah has miraculously destroyed or sent the winds and caused them to disperse so the sahaba came back elated overjoyed and they took their armor off and they went back home after one month of a siege obviously they need to relax they need to recover they need to recuperate now jubilee came to the prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam and he said to the prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam if you have taken your armor off realize the angels have not taken their armors off we still have to deal with the treachery of the banu koreda now there was a treacherous incident that they betrayed the muslims backstabbed the muslims and they needed to be dealt with that had it not been for the miracle of allah subhanahu wa ta'ala the treachery of the banu quran might have been fatal for the entire community so those traitors have to be dealt with so jubilee came and said to the prophet sallallahu alaihi we have not taken our armors off we have to deal with those people and therefore the prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam wore his armor again and he went out and he prayed salat okay keep the chronology in mind he prayed the voher prayer and he announced to the gathering that basically hurry up go back home change your into your your your your your military gear again and then hasten to get to the lands of the banu which was around and now two hours let's say a walk or two hours from the masjid of the prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam and he gave that command none of you should pray the asa prayer until you get to the banu okay you understand what's going on he's praying and he's basically saying get to banu before salat i want you to pray your do not pray also with me do not pray outside in your homes get back home hasten up arm yourself back get onto your your camels and your horses and you march to the banu such that the goal being you arrive there before salat al-maghrib so you will pray and then we will deal with the traitors now the announcement was made and it caused a little bit of a panic and chaos people have to go home and tell their families and pack and you know everything has to happen and by the time so the prophet saws immediately left like he's ready he's already put his armor him and his entourage salah they have left and they're going to get to the way before the rest and he's waiting for the rest of them to come now what happens so the the batch that leaves right they leave too late they leave too late they weren't able to get ready they weren't prepared it took a while i mean it's understandable it took a while and so by the time they leave it's already past after time it's already passed asur and they're going towards the banu quraydah and the sun is about to set and they're not going to catch the maghrib salah sorry the asura if they delay it all the way to the banu koreda okay so understand what's going on here let me give you a hypothetical example suppose the sunset was at 6 00 pm let's say right and they would arrive at 7 pm it's already 5 30 and there is no way that they're going to be able to pray unless they delay it right so now they have a clash what should they do should they take the verbatim literal meaning of the hadith do not pray asar until you reach banu and so they will watch the sun sunset and they will not stop for salah and they will allow their asl to become kada right because the prophet saws said do not pray until you get to or do they understand the rationale do they understand that you know what was intended was to hurry up and to make haste and to try to get there before us now that we were not able to do that well then obviously we should pray asar now and then we'll pray maghrib when we get you understand this i hope insha'allah the two scenarios right once again the issue is how literal do you want to be do you want to take it at face value or will you understand the rationale and then where the rationale does not exist you will not apply the ruling so the sahaba began to talk amongst themselves one group said he said we should only pray therefore we are not going to pray salat right now we're going to watch the sun set and we have the opportunity to pray but we are obeying the messenger sallallahu alaihi wasallam and we're going to get to the banu and we will pray after maghrib time right we'll pray after maghrib time we're going to pray and then we're going to pray maghrib and the other group said no but that's not the intent that's not the goal you know that's not the the point of saying this and there is a rationale and now that that rationale is not being met we're supposed to pray and then work our way there guess what happened the sahaba could not figure out amongst themselves one united plan and therefore some groups of people decided to not pray and they continued marching onwards delaying assad until after maghrib and another group they stopped and they prayed as a right then and there and they finished asl and they prayed it on time and then they marched onwards when both groups arrived the prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam rebuked neither of them he did not make this an issue it was not something that was a big deal oh my god you guys are following the sunnah against the sunnah no the both of them tried their best and the both of them examined the tradition and they reached different views now this same if you like tension in terms of understanding the text the same tension it has trickled down to many of our rulings as well okay the same philosophy of okay should we just take this and then verbatim apply it which is what you know many uh groups do or should we think about the rationale and the the issue comes of course uh you know my position is that uh that both of these groups are alhamdulillah respected that we should at least allow them to discuss and engage the main issue comes unfortunately which is i am opposed to this is that one of these two strands one of these two paradigms has essentially taken over or eclipsed if you like the fatwa scene and especially social media especially you know islam websites that are answering q about islam these types of websites they they give positions that they are respected in their own in their own mind but what has happened is that a a a very literal sense comes that does not allow for any type of thinking through any type of rationale and in fact uh even some of those scholars of that trend themselves have criticized others uh one of my own teachers that he would say many times he would publicly complain about the rise of literalism the vahidism is called the rise of literalism and the diminishing of understanding and the problem comes the issue is not that one group holds this the issue is that unlike the sahaba who allowed for two opinions this group does not allow the possibility of any other view being legitimate and this is really the problem the problem of intolerance the problem of if you don't agree with my literalism you are rejecting the sunnah you are against the sunnah and therefore you are somebody who is going to be doomed or lana to allah or something of this nature and another major problem that comes is that this group even though they're small and they're relatively modern despite the fact they claim to go back uh to the earliest of times the fact is that undeniably that they jump over they buy pash bypass 14 centuries of scholarship and they restrict the understanding of islam to a small group of modern scholars of one particular land of one particular mindset that are self-replicating their own views over and over again and the problem is not in them holding the views that's perfectly fine the problem is them imposing that one view on the entire globe such that anybody who contradicts their narrative is deemed to be somebody who is against the sunnah of the prophet sallallahu alaihi wasallam and this is extremism and this is a type of narrow-mindedness and dangerous mentality that in fact does cause uh a fanaticism and it does lead to many problems of the uh the net result therefore of all of this is that you do get a group of people that are very literalist very uh you know very committed and dedicated to the interpretations of their ulama and anybody who disagrees with them is deemed to be not worthy of their love or attention and this is not good for the ummah and one of the main points in me going into this detail and talking about all of this and in fact my entire philosophy when i do these q a is to preach tolerance and respect of our tradition i might have my views and i may maybe will try to prove my views you know you know in with passion but if respected have other views no problem that's their you know methodology and allah azzawajal will reward them for their uh sincerity now with all of this was a prelude to this question because again you have to understand that this group of scholars because of socio-political factors economic factors they do dominate the waves if you like they dominate social media they dominate they have influenced modern discourse to the point that many muslims don't really even know that this is a very small minority and we have alhamdulillah a very uh beautiful heritage and history of islamic scholarship so today i will demonstrate for you that in fact there have been diverse opinions from the very beginning of time and the greatest ulama have actually given exceptions to this hadith there's nothing that is new that is that is coming here so we look first and foremost at the evidence and uh how it was understood in the earliest of times now in this particular case ibn masuru radhillah the one who narrated the hadith it is very clear that he would not allow his own women to practice this these types of things and so he was of those basically saying the hadith says it let's let's just let's just practice it interestingly enough our mother she's also one of the narrators of this hadith she's also narrating this hadith as well in one of the versions and yet we have reported from her that she would allow women to pluck hair from their faces so again very interesting over here uh it is reported uh in a number of earlier books including uh the book of uh uh the kitab of abu usuf the student of hanifa and also ibn batal the commentary of bihari he mentions this that abu ishaq mentions that my wife visited her and she asked her and my wife was a lady who loved to beautify herself right so otherwise how cause narrating this that my wife was a lady who loved to beautify herself we were newly married she's a young lady she wants to beautify her love herself and she asked that is it permissible for a woman to pluck her eyebrows and isha our mother says you may remove anything that irritates you you don't like it as much as you want right you may beautify yourself as much as you want it is also reported in the muslin that a woman was with her and she said oh mother of the believers there are hairs in my face that i don't like may i uh pluck them in order to beautify myself for my husband and aisha once again said to her that you may get rid of anything that irritates you and prepare for your husband as you prepare when guests come to visit you when other ladies come and you make yourself look good so then you should prepare yourself for your husband as well in other words you know when you have visitors and guests coming ladies are coming to visit you then you will look you know dignified and nice and what not so ashrae allah is saying that yes of course you make yourself look good and you beautify yourself for your husband now here we have a very important if you like two different paradigms from the very beginning that ibn masrud would not allow his own wives to do any of these things and he is taking the basically the literal version which is completely allowed as we said this is something that does exist from the time of the sahaba and we have and she is the lady by the way and she should know better and she is the one this the the the rulings are pertaining to her that she is giving this fatwa that the lady is literally saying that i want to uh basically shave off or or trim my eyebrows am i allowed to do that and she is saying you may do that so we find this tension if you like again from the there was no tension between but i'm saying the tension and understanding this narration also from the earliest of times a number of our scholars were wondering that the hadith here we do need to think about this is um overall it's something that uh would not be considered let's say uh if the hadith had not come about eyebrows that generally speaking nobody would assume this to be a sin and you beautify yourself a woman is allowed to uh shave anybody here she wants in fact she's she is mandated to shave as you know certain parts of her body the man and the woman and she may keep her hair as long or as short as she wants she may put on any type of bangles or beautification for her husband dressed up for her husband so the question about the lana of allah coming upon something like an eyebrow right and generally speaking allah is a very very big deal allah is huge allah azza his upon those who reject him his land is upon the idol worshipers his land is upon uh the one who murders it's in the quran right that the one who murders that is on him so if you look at the sins that allah has given the lana these are major sins now to add eyebrows to the list one wonders what is going on and i'm not the first one to wonder you have for example the famous the great animal qarafi one of the great ulama of the mariki method he writes in his book that he mentions this hadith and he says that you know i haven't seen the scholars of the malikis and the shah first discussing the reasons or the causes of why there island in this in this situation i don't understand why because uh he says that i understand that if this is a woman who is deceiving her other people in order to basically uh pretend that she is somebody that's more beautiful than she is when the suitor comes when somebody proposes for her then uh i understand however if it is for the wife for her husband then there is no uh deception going on and so he's like questioning that what is this how can we understand the the la na and another great scholar of our tradition the great mufasa ibn ashur ibn ashur wrote one of the most original and amazing commentaries of the quran called and ibn ashur he writes that as for this hadith of allah on on these on these categories of women he says it is something that is difficult to interpret or understand like i don't understand why there's la na on these uh things and he says the only interpretation that i find to be reasonable is that these characteristics were the characteristics of the ladies of ill repute i.e the prostitutes of that time the ladies of ill repute of that time and they would use these characteristics uh to advertise their profession that way and uh the the the the famous scholar when i showed he says that even if the sharia were to forbid these things for whatever reasons it should not reach the level of lan in and of itself this is ibn saying here so he is basically saying that the reason why these things have been prohibited is that in those days when a lady practiced that evil profession in order to advertise that she is that type of lady she would have certain characteristics and of them is that she would remove her eyebrows let's say or of them is that she would do the other things mentioned in this hadith and therefore it now makes sense allah is on those ladies that are selling themselves to this matter because obviously that is destroying society destroying the moral fabric of society that now we understand the coming because not on plucking a hair the lana will be on the the the women that are doing that for the sake of this evil uh you know profession so this is something that says and ibn al-jozi also mentions a similar comment the famous himalayas called ibn josie he also mentioned something similar in this regard and therefore we find these they're trying to rationalize like why is this uh thing that that has been prohibited again like even ashu said if allah made it haram we understand okay it's his right to make it haram nobody can question but then one wonders something like this to have the lahna on it what is causing the that must be something more than just plucking the eyebrow and that's why these say that the interpretation is that the la na was for this profession and these characteristics were symbolic of that profession this makes a lot of sense now what did the fukaha what did the scholars of say about this issue of women plucking their eyebrows well again the madahib have differed over this issue and yes there is no question that many ulama took this hadith and they considered to be copy and paste and literal and they said this is what it is and there's no problem with that opinion and as i will conclude there is there is no doubt there is no doubt that that is the safer opinion there is no doubt that you're getting out of any controversy but there have been alternative voices from the very beginning of time our mother is the first one to set this entire paradigm and are we going to accuse her of not following the sunnah in this regard and again the point being that we have this controversy from the very beginning of time even if you don't agree with it at least respect it at least know that it exists and understand that there are many ulama who have held the other view in fact the great scholar imam ahmad he had a very interesting view in this regard imam ahmad said that what is prohibited is the plucking of the eyebrow in his opinion he said if a woman shaves it or later hambali scholar said that if she dies it for example such that it's no longer seen you know then it would be permissible so the imam ahmed was asked about this as even says was asked that should a lady remove the hair of her eyebrows said i don't like that she plucks it but i don't have a problem if she if she shaves it this is the imam of the school many of the later people who follow this imam in our times they disagree or they don't mention this very fatwa from imam himself and other great hambali scholars even allowed more than this even allowed more than this uh of course ibn kadam the famous uh the the great author of uh uh al-muri ibrahim also mentions that the prohibition in the hadith is for plucking not for shaving he says somebody if a woman wants to shave this says by the way i have to make the disclaimer here that we're talking about just the eyebrows as for any other facial hair there should be no problem with that so if there's any hair growing because it is not the natural default of woman is to grow isn't to not grow hair uh in the chin area or above the lips or whatnot that hair of course it can be removed the hadith comes about the name slot and the the interpretation is that namos is to remove the hair uh to pluck the hair of the eyebrows that's how imam ahmad understood that the prohibition is to pluck the hair and he goes this is a type of basically mutilation or whatnot and he allowed the shaving of it now this is imam ahmed's position some hambali rama actually allowed for more than this and of them is the great uh alim and the sheikh and the zahid and the saint abdul qadir al-jilani you've all heard of abdul qaddafi what many people do not know was that he was a great adam and he was a hambali as well and in his he says that as for the lady then the medha basically is that that she should not remove her eyebrow she should not shape her eyebrows and then he says and others have argued that it is allowed for the lady who is married to shape her eyebrows for her husband if her husband wants her to do that and also if that she feels that you know if she doesn't do so then her husband might you know turn away from her or find interest in other maybe another marriage or something and she's going to have issues or problems in this case he says it is allowed for her to beautify herself by shaping her eyebrows because there is a clear benefit to be gained over here just like this is still this is still abdulkad just like it is allowed for her to wear beautiful clothing and to wear good perfume and to wear uh the most expensive garments or primary or whatnot and to be playful and to be jesting and jokeful joking with her husband all of these are encouraged for her and therefore listen is for the ladies that are doing it for prostitution for other men to come to them that are not their husbands notice this is the rationale we talked about right from the time of the sahaba right word of prasa looking at the reasoning and then saying okay the reasoning is the prostitution and therefore when it's not done for that because it's no longer a sign that was something that was assigned back then these days as you are aware it is no longer a sign just for one class of ladies and so qaddafi says if a woman does it for her husband cannot be upon uh this lady and it's not just abdul qatar al-jilani one of the greatest humble ulama of his era the great adam and the great scholar ibn al-josi he also has this same position in fact yoshido ibn josi actually has the largest book ever written in the hambury school about women overall he has the rulings about women it's like 400 500 volumes the edition that i have and it's all about the rulings of women and the the blessings of women and you know how to treat women the hadith about women it's a very interesting book it's a whole book about basically the treatment or the and he himself he has a section obviously in this book about this hadith and even a josie and again i i ask those brothers that are in their eagerness they want to just refute by quoting some modern scholars of one land would you would you consider even a josie to be somebody who rejects hadith to be somebody who's a modernist or progressive no josie this is ibn jose ibn jose writes this listen to this that the apparent meaning of these hadith seems to be that the the prohibition of these things is unconditional that's the apparent meaning he says that it's very clear and that unconditional understanding is what ibn masrud himself derived from this so he admits there is an opinion out there and that opinion is that there are no circumstances where this is allowed and that's ibn masuru's view excellent then he goes and it is also possible to interpret this hadith in one of three ways okay there's another opinion as well this is immediate the first of them that this was a sign for prostitutes this is the jose saying this was a sign for those that are seeking to seduce men so the la na is for them not for the action but for the the the lifestyle what they are doing number one number two he goes one can also interpret that this is for uh ladies now again you have to remember back then you know the veil sometimes even the face covering would be put and so uh women when they're single they might want to uh portray themselves to be other than how they look and so the second is that there is a type of deception that is being done the lady should be who she is when the suitor comes to see whether he wants to propose or not the both of them should know how they are so this is the second thing that there is a type of deception he goes that is also not allowed number three he said uh for the tattoos this is not for the nums that number three is that there is a permanent change to the creation of allah like in the tattoos this is nothing nothing to do with the the thing here so he goes as for the the eyebrow thing so uh we must interpret it the the hadith of the plucking of the eyebrows we should understand it in one of the first two categories either it was meant for uh women of ill repute or it was meant for those that are trying to deceive a suitor when they are single and they want to deceive somebody that they look different than they actually look then ibn jose says my own teacher alan multi he would say and this is the humbling he would say that if a lady takes from her hair of her face for in order to beautify herself for her husband right lisa jihad there is no problem for that the problem comes when a person comes to propose and he doesn't know what the lady looks like and she tries to deceive him you know what they might be covering her but not she tries to deceive him in that matter that would be problematic now again this is ibn jose what are you going to do about this this great scholar ibn jose that is in the hambali madhya the shah ferry school is much more explicit actually this is the fatwa of the shaffer school the shaffer is cool they understood this hadith by and large to apply to single ladies uh that are trying to deceive or trying to to portray themselves other than they are they explicitly allowed married ladies to beautify themselves for their husbands and they said this is of the goals of the sharia why wouldn't we want a lady to beautify herself for her husband and one of the great icons of the shaffer school alma urdi who died 450 hijrah of course he is the author of kabir when the encyclopedias of he explicitly says that if the lady is that uzojin that uh if a lady does this to beautify herself for her husband this is not haram why he says the woman is required she is obliged to beautify herself for her husband this was also the position of imam al-ghazali also the shaffer is called the famous al-qazali and other scholars as well now again you will find some of the shah varimath that uh they did not they did not allow this so that's fine as well but this is the default of the uh of the position and in fact in al hafiz himself the great shaffray authority in the father-body he basically says that uh if the husband allows this and approves this then it is something that is allowed to do it is something that is allowed to do therefore you now have uh the sha free madhhab as well allowing this and as for the malikis again you have a number of maliki's allowing this as well i'll call the ayat he himself mentions the narration of aisha about this issue of allowing some people to pluck and uh the uh the the the the malik is called either way he says in kefir that when he says this prohibition it will apply to those ladies only those ladies who are not allowed to beautify themselves right so women who are married to their husbands they are obliged to beautify that narration will not apply to them now this and uh the the same applies in the hanafi school you will find a number of authorities again the fatah hindiya of the hanafi school it allows the married lady to beautify herself for husband in this regard and yes you will find some hanafi's who also follow even mr rude's fatwa that doesn't allow it unconditionally now therefore uh to to to conclude i will quote you uh the modern encyclopedia uh the the mosu affair which is a modern encyclopedia written by a group of that uh volume 15 page 69 they say the majority of scholars have opined that this prohibition of the hadith is not universal it's not unconditional and even masood and others they said it is unconditional and they said that it is haram in all circumstances however the majority said that it is not allowed for a single lady to beautify herself in this regard as for the married lady or any lady that requires any type of you know uh if some type of issue has happened medical issue or whatnot then there is no problem in her doing that and they say this is the majority of scholars have allowed this uh because uh the lady is required or uh obliged to beautify herself for her husband therefore uh to conclude this first question to conclude all of this we state the concept of uh beautification overall is something that without a doubt is allowed for a lady within the confines of the shariah and to beautify herself for her husband is one of the most important uh you know characteristics of women they want to beautify themselves and they should beautify themselves and the goals of the shetty i would indicate that a woman is beautiful for her husband and the husband is you know looking good for her uh uh for his wife and taking care of her the two of them should have uh you know that love and that care and that comfort with each other now uh the sharia of course has prohibited certain types of things that are haram obviously uh you know you cannot do things that would be permanent such as a tattoo because that's a complete change however generally speaking a woman's personal preferences of hair and makeup and and jewelry and clothing and style generally speaking the sharia is silent on that and so the sharia has allowed the lady to dress up especially in the privacy of her house in a manner that is pleasing to her husband and vice versa the husband should do the same now this hadith comes along and our scholars from the very beginning of time you know they're trying to understand that even if sometimes we don't understand allah's wisdom that's definitely nope not a problem we don't know why we do tawaf seven times we just submit totally understandable but here we have something that as our scholars say when the reward or the punishment doesn't fit the crime we have to think a little bit more why would the latina come on plucking some hair from the face and that that question has been asked by many great ulama of the past and the response seems to be very obvious to many ulama i just quoted you some of them in today's lecture and that is that the lana or the curse of allah was not on the action of plucking the eyebrow it was on its association with that lifestyle that was well known uh and everybody who did that was known to be of those who practiced that lifestyle and that's why the la na came now that makes complete sense therefore when the cause does not exist anymore when a lady is doing it not for that reason and she's doing in a halal manner to satisfy her husband does the same ruling apply this is where we now see so many great ulama have difference of opinion and we have the shaffer madhhab and we have imna josie and we have called the of the malikis and we have some of the ahnaf and we had himself by the way of course he did not to be clear as i said muhammad allowed the shaving which is again if you wanted to be humbly then you may follow that position that don't pluck it the shave at the point that you will get the same thing done his point was just any we don't know why just allah has you know cursed the plucking so then don't pluck but do anything else that you want so uh again if you wanted to follow that position now the other position which is ibn masrit's position is of course dominant in one strand of modern islam that claims to follow the salaf and that's not a problem there's no problem following that to that strand or that interpretation because ibn masrud was also the one who followed it my issue or my complaint or my criticism is in the condemnation of the other opinion as having no merit whatsoever and this is the problem of basically fanaticism and intolerance i've just quoted you great uh from the past these were not you know modern people who are liberal and western or taking from the kuffars or america or england these are great rulima ibn jose as i said from within the hambury tradition and all of these are again as usual this is a smaller lecture and so bottom line if you wish to follow the shaffer position and many other ulama and for the married lady to beautify herself for the sake of her husband then inshallah you have great precedence and there should be no problem in that and if you wanted to follow the more conservative opinion and you wish to be on the safer side and er on the side of caution and follow ibn masrud's position in this regard rather than the allah's position you definitely have precedence and that's something that definitely again no problem in doing that but i respect the other position understand the other position is there now that having been said none of the scholars allowed it for uh the lady that was not doing it for her husband so please understand this point let us stick with our tradition and not uh you know completely change it for absolutely no reason none of the scholars allowed it for the lady to beautify herself for people that are not basically her husband so you understand this point here that we're not going to open that door we're talking about married women to beautify themselves for their husbands then in sha allah there is concession from the time of and other than that uh definitely we should stick with uh the traditions as much as possible and allah subhanahu wa'ta'ala knows best foreign